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Hi Product People,

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Finding the right balance between innovation and predictability is a challenge every product leader faces, especially in enterprise environments where both flexibility and structure are needed. Many organizations turn to SAFe to try to remedy this.

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While I am not a proponent of Scaled Agile Framework (SAFe), I do think it’s important to hear the lessons learned from people who have implemented it so you can effectively decide if this is right for your context.

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In this week's Product Thinking episode, Christopher Li, SVP of Product at Xactly, shares his experience with implementing and adapting SAFe to better connect big-picture vision with day-to-day execution.

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Christopher's team at Xactly introduced a quarterly planning discipline through SAFe, which complemented their existing annual roadmap. This approach allowed them to stay on track while being flexible enough to adjust to new information. However, the shift wasn’t without its challenges. Christopher talked about the hurdles they faced, particularly in managing the changes and ensuring the new processes didn’t overwhelm the team.

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One key takeaway from our conversation is the value of a gradual rollout. Instead of a full-scale adoption, Xactly chose a phased approach, giving them the time to refine and adjust their processes to meet the needs of their team.

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We also talked about how Chris dealt with the Product Owner vs Product Manager issues SAFe introduces, that ended with him eventually opting for one career path rather than two.

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If you're working through similar challenges in your organization, or considering SAFe, this episode offers insights into balancing structured planning with the need to remain agile.

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Have you introduced SAFe into your company? What worked and what didn't? I’d love to hear your thoughts! Share them with me on LinkedIn or respond to this email!

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See you soon, Melissa Perri Founder Product Institute, Board Member, and Teacher

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Key Moments on the Podcast to Check Out:

04:52 - Phasing in Agile and Scaled Agile Framework

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Christopher discusses the approach he took to balance predictability and innovation at Xactly by phasing in an agile methodology alongside the Scaled Agile Framework (SAFe). Recognizing the limitations of an annual roadmap in maintaining both long-term vision and day-to-day execution, Chris and his team introduced a quarterly discipline through SAFe. This method allowed them to complement their existing roadmap with a more adaptable and dynamic approach. However, Chris also acknowledges the challenges that came with adopting SAFe, particularly in terms of change management and process fatigue. Despite widespread buy-in, the sheer number of moving parts within SAFe necessitated a gradual integration rather than a wholesale adoption, which ultimately allowed for more tailored and effective process improvements.

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22:03 - Merging Product Owner and Product Manager Roles

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Christopher discusses the transition from having distinct roles for Product Owners (POs) and Product Managers (PMs) to a more integrated approach. Historically, these roles were segregated, with POs focused internally on the R&D organization, while PMs were more market and customer-facing. However, Li's team found more long-term benefits in merging these roles into a hierarchical structure. As POs gain experience in implementing and shipping products, they naturally transition to PM roles, taking on market-facing responsibilities while delegating internal tasks to incoming POs. This shift not only enhances collaboration but also boosts morale by offering a clearer path for career progression, allowing individuals to explore various facets of product management based on their interests and strengths.

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27:18 - The Importance of Cross-Functional Experience in Leadership

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Li highlights the value of cross-functional experience in developing strong leadership within product management. He notes that many of the best leaders he has worked with have experience in various roles beyond product management, such as sales or engineering. This diverse experience gives them a well-rounded perspective on the business, enabling them to better understand how different teams and functions operate and how they can work together effectively. Li mentions that when he started his career, product management was not as well-defined, and people often found their way into the field through other roles. This organic approach helped build a broader business understanding, which is now more structured due to the growing allure of product management as a career path.

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​Episode Resources:

• ​Christopher Li​
• ​Xactly Corp​

Other Resources:

• ​Angel Squad​
• ​Productinstitute.com​

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